Andrew Clear:

Only thing I don't like is the 150 mb limit, but, I am finding ways to pack as much data as I can into that 150 mb CC package.  Trying to have a game that lasts hours, and have a good musical score, is a pain, but, with some creative thinking, I've worked around some of those hurdles.

It's the same limit full XBLA games get, so it's only fair. If you need help with compression, check out the EasyZip link in my signature. It's an open-source library that automatically puts your game content into a ZIP file. It can really help shrinking sizes. There may be a bug with the Xbox version, but I'm looking into it this week. Maybe that will help shrink that content down for you.

Good luck on breaking into the industry. I know myself and some others are hoping to do the same, so it will be interesting when the Community Games launches later this year.

zook83:

Belkar, I just visit your puzzle game blog. I played a Nintendo DS game called Labyrinth which looks similar to your game. Be careful with their IP.

Belkar:

Thanks for the heads up. I'd never seen that before. I'm not sure where to go with this ...

I think your case is an example of a controversial game. It looks similar to an existing one, but... is it breaking the laws related to IP? I'm neither a lawyer nor a judge and, therefore, I can't decide if a game is breaking the law. I can only warn about this situation. I'll approve this game if Belkar sends it to the peer review system in the future because I think it only uses a similar concept, like an FPS uses the same concepts used by other FPS's. But may exist people (Microsoft?) with a different point of view. If any XNA Team guy is reading this, please, can you talk about how these cases are going to be managed?

Looking similar isn't illegal. Unless you're using ripped graphics or other assets from games I doubt there would be an issue.

Nick Gravelyn:

Andrew Clear:

Only thing I don't like is the 150 mb limit, but, I am finding ways to pack as much data as I can into that 150 mb CC package.  Trying to have a game that lasts hours, and have a good musical score, is a pain, but, with some creative thinking, I've worked around some of those hurdles.

It's the same limit full XBLA games get, so it's only fair. If you need help with compression, check out the EasyZip link in my signature. It's an open-source library that automatically puts your game content into a ZIP file. It can really help shrinking sizes. There may be a bug with the Xbox version, but I'm looking into it this week. Maybe that will help shrink that content down for you.

Good luck on breaking into the industry. I know myself and some others are hoping to do the same, so it will be interesting when the Community Games launches later this year.

I was looking into that before I made that last post.  I think my main problem is that I am stubborn, and I don't want to make compromises with some of the key points of my game.  I can cut corners with graphics and save a lot of space that way, but music, that is an issue.  I think I found a way to solve that issue, without making my game sound the same for several hours.  (I am only allowing 40 MB of the final 150 mb file to be music and sounds).

I really wanted full voice acting....blasted 150 mb limit...

Andrew Clear:

I really wanted full voice acting....blasted 150 mb limit...

You could always include the things that don't fit into the XNA Community version into a Windows version.

I really wanted full voice acting....blasted 150 mb limit...

How much voice acting do you have? For download, you can put voice into mono, 11 kHz 16 bit files. Sure, not crystalline in quality, but good enough to convey the message. With 4:1 compression (ADPCM) that gives you 21.5 kB/second. If you put that into 40 MB, you get over half an hour of continuous dialog -- that's a lot! With XMA, perhaps you can even get better quality or smaller files, or both.
Delivering an epic RPG along the lines of Oblivion or Jade Empire probably can't be done in 150 MB of download, but I'm assuming that's not something you could build on an indie budget anyway.

Hi all!

I've got a minor question about how Community Games are going to be shown to the users into their Xbox 360's. When you launch a game, you need wait for a while in order to view the first graphical content. Till then, you have an ugly black screen. I think an end user may find this strange; non-XNA games show nothing similar. You start the game and, inmediately, you get graphical content. But in XNA games you must wait a few seconds... What about a customizable splash screen to avoid this?

How the games are displayed depends on the developer of the game. There's no reason why a game can't start with a splash screen. I'm pretty sure I've seen this already in some games.

Yeah, but before the game starts it takes about ten seconds for the launcher or something to initialise.

Machaira:

How the games are displayed depends on the developer of the game. There's no reason why a game can't start with a splash screen. I'm pretty sure I've seen this already in some games.

DarthCheesiest:

Yeah, but before the game starts it takes about ten seconds for the launcher or something to initialise.

As DarthCheesiest says, I'm talking about a system issue, not a coding one. When you execute a game from the Xbox 360, not from Visual Studio, you must wait a few seconds (which are very much for an end user) BEFORE the first line of your code (including the splash screen Machaira commented) is executed. If I remember well, Java has a feature which allows you to show an splash screen WHILE the runtime is loaded (not AFTER, as occurs now with XNA on the 360). We need something similar. Other way to mitigate the problem is to load the runtime the first time you launch an XNA game, unloading it only when you go out of the Creators Club Dashboard section.

Btw, recently I tried to execute one of the demos I downloaded when they were published for limited time. I got the famous black screen and, after waiting some seconds, I got returned to the XNA games section without explanations. I know the game can not be executed because the trial period finished, but I was surprised for not being informed by the system. I think the final version of the XNA Game Launcher should inform you why you can't execute the game.

I just timed it. It takes about 5 seconds to hit the loading screen for Aegis Wing, an XBLA title. For my Xbox game it takes it 9 seconds. I don't think those extra four seconds are really going to turn off any users. If they really have that short of an attention span, they should probably get some help.

As for the trial games, yes they should have a better system, but those were just temporary demos. They probably were tossed together last minute. Hopefully the real service will be better about handling trials (if we get to do those).