Game Publishing/Business

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

reallyjoel — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 15:06:10 GMT

Well it doesn't matter that much really when I think about it, because you can empose your own limit if you like. Our game is a party game with 3 minute matches, and I think that with say a 20 minute limit, people would just restart the trial game and never buy the real deal, so we will probably have our own time limit or limit on the number of games you can play in one sitting, aswell as limiting the game content.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Jim Perry — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:44:49 GMT

Information on the exact amount of time hasn't been released (unless I'm getting senile, which is a possibility).

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

reallyjoel — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:03:39 GMT

One question I haven't seen answered here is exactly how long the trial time is. That's what I'd like to know. Perhaps MS hasn't decided yet.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Zack Nelson — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 15:12:08 GMT

The ZMan:

According to the Schizoid post mortem XBLA games are not allowed to have NETWORKED multiplayer in demos, though you can do splitscreen (wonder if you can do system link).. are you sure marble blast implemented it?

Yes, though it was a long time ago (rules for XBLA titles might have been different then). You couldnt send invites and multiplayer was rather limited (only having a small number of players in a game and only one map to play on).

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

The ZMan — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 05:13:01 GMT

According to the Schizoid post mortem XBLA games are not allowed to have NETWORKED multiplayer in demos, though you can do splitscreen (wonder if you can do system link).. are you sure marble blast implemented it?

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Zack Nelson — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 20:16:50 GMT

PrettyBoyTim:
Shawn Hargreaves:
It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)

It would be nice to be able to give the player some idea of what extra stuff they can expect in the full game, even if it was just passing the API a short list of things to put in bullet points and perhaps an image to accompany them.

I was reading through a Gamefest Slideshow and that is one good way to sell an Arcade title. What I dont get is why dosent trial versions allow networking. Hurts people that are making absolute multiplayer games like ShadowRun (just an example) or Net Rumble. GarageGames put online multiplayer in a trial version of Marble Blast Ultra and it did well.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

PrettyBoyTim — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 15:40:16 GMT

Shawn Hargreaves:
It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)

It would be nice to be able to give the player some idea of what extra stuff they can expect in the full game, even if it was just passing the API a short list of things to put in bullet points and perhaps an image to accompany them.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

FlipperAnubi — Sun, 21 Sep 2008 17:11:12 GMT

I think you should get a 360 (sounds like you don't have one), and try it out. That's how I'm handling what was called the "out of game" experience. What do OTHER games do? Buy a few games, sign in, sign out, trial, purchased... You'll get an idea of what gamers expect. In reference to "disabling features isn't a good way to make money in this business.", I'd say that's a bit of a generalization. Essentially all the games on XBLA disable some single player features during trial mode, and of course, no LIVE multiplayer (and I think no local multiplayer either). And I'd say people are making lots of money on LIVE! So... whether good or bad, it's something that 360 gamers have come to accept.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Cdxrd — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 22:22:13 GMT

Thanks for the clarification.. I'm just one of those people who wants to have his cake and eat it to. I want people to buy the game, but I also hate disabling features for a demo for people. That isn't a good way to make money in this business, but.. lol.. ah well, guess I will have to think about some different ideas when the time comes.. someone give me a 360 now so I can use the XBCG.. =)

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

The ZMan — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 17:24:13 GMT

Cdxrd:
Shawn Hargreaves:
It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)
Also the time limit is per-run, so if they still aren't sure, they can always just quit out and launch the game again to play it for a second trial.

So that opens up another issue... if they still arent sure, they can get a second trial.. so how many of those 'trials' can they get?

For a lot of games thats not going to be an issue.. but for example, using my game Kollectiv, its a casual puzzle game.. something people play for a few minutes, then are done till they want to play again. Again, I load spider solitaire and play a game, 20 minutes later im done until I want to play again in a few days. With that kind of playing habit, and if the 'trial' is say 30 minutes, that wouldnt be much incentive to purchase the game.. not when they can keep getting another 'trial'. Some people will say lock out levels, or disable particular features, but in a puzzle game like this there isnt a whole lot you can limit..

If its like the rest of games on XBLA - there is no limit. I can play each game demo as many times as I want. This is why the XNA team expose a flag that tells you if you are in demo mode. You would have to use that to restrict some part of the game. On XBLA they usually dangle the achievements in front of you but we dont have that so you will have to do something like stop the game when they get up to a certain score, or hide other modes or something.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Jim Hunter — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 17:21:25 GMT

Nothing says you can't make the time limit shorter than that imposed by XBLCG, or stop the game at some predetermined point in the game (a few steps before the player wins). You could also limit the number of times the game can be played, though I suppose the user could delete any savegame data. (Assuming that trial mode games can save data -- I seem to remember this question being asked but don't remember if there was an official answer). If the price isn't prohibitive, people may be willing to pay just for the privilege of keeping game statistics and high scores.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Cdxrd — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 17:12:35 GMT

Shawn Hargreaves:
It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)
Also the time limit is per-run, so if they still aren't sure, they can always just quit out and launch the game again to play it for a second trial.

So that opens up another issue... if they still arent sure, they can get a second trial.. so how many of those 'trials' can they get?

For a lot of games thats not going to be an issue.. but for example, using my game Kollectiv, its a casual puzzle game.. something people play for a few minutes, then are done till they want to play again. Again, I load spider solitaire and play a game, 20 minutes later im done until I want to play again in a few days. With that kind of playing habit, and if the 'trial' is say 30 minutes, that wouldnt be much incentive to purchase the game.. not when they can keep getting another 'trial'. Some people will say lock out levels, or disable particular features, but in a puzzle game like this there isnt a whole lot you can limit..

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

The ZMan — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 22:05:05 GMT

They do have an icon for our game too - maybe that can display that on the screen with the name.

Of course once we know the timer limit we can interrupt earlier and ask the user if they want to buy and THEN take them to the buy screen. At least that way the user will feel they initiated the buy and will associate the decision with their action.

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Nick Gravelyn — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 22:00:44 GMT

Shawn Hargreaves:
It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)
Also the time limit is per-run, so if they still aren't sure, they can always just quit out and launch the game again to play it for a second trial.

Both valid points, however my concern is that consumers are used to the XBLA experience where the buy screen has some customized display with a couple screenshots and maybe some bullet points of what they get by unlocking the full game. I think by not having that available for XBLCG it does us developers a great disservice because our consumers will not know why they should bother paying for our game unless we advertise that in-game. And if we're already doing it in-game, it defeats the generic buy screen. I bet it's too late, but I put up a Connect issue for this. :)

Re: How can I upload demo/complete version?

Shawn Hargreaves — Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:21:07 GMT

It's a generic screen. I assume we'll have your game title in there, but you don't get to customize it. Presumably by that point they've already been playing the game for long enough to know what it is they're deciding whether to buy :-)

Also the time limit is per-run, so if they still aren't sure, they can always just quit out and launch the game again to play it for a second trial.